My favourite Internet cartoon.....bar none.

In my case the wording is slightly different....

[scene ...3am, Melbourne time]

Terry ..."Are you [ever] coming to bed?"

Jafo ..."I can't, this is important."

Terry ..."What?"

Jafo ..."Someone is being an arsehole on Wincustomize."

[it's the gospel truth ....and more than once] ....

A) what does one have to do with the other?

B ) I said you can send the health care link to me via private message and we can continue this offline

and

C) You already know who am I. And if you know how to use google you've already read my 12 page public resume.

But, more importantly, how you got that information could be of great concern to your customers here, since it APPEARS as though you or one of your employees has violated my privacy with regards to my client/customer accounts with your company in the past 24 hours.  Since yesterday you did not know who am I, but today you OBVIOUSLY do.

IF THIS IS TRUE, I think that, using my private business/beta information with your company just to try and obtain negotiating points in a public forum discussion...and a truly meaningless one at that...shows a clear lack of ETHICS.

And if I am wrong about this, and you have not done anything unethical here, then say so and you will have my prompt and sincere apology.  My word is bond and I hope yours is too.

Either way, from my PRIVATE name and resume, you can at least gather that everything I have said about myself is 100% true, and, in fact, I have been modest about my accomplishments to date.  And that's even considering that I haven't updated any of it for the last couple of years. 

Fair enough.  The ones I've seen are just a shell game.  I'm glad yours isn't and I'm glad to hear that your employees are getting equivalent cost/care to what they did 10,20,30 years ago, before Kaiser and Nixon created the HMOs.

Get the shovels and galoshes as it's getting pretty deep in here.

I can think of a couple I caused myself.

Again, I've said nothing of the kind in either case.  I think you are selectively interpreting what I have to say to serve some internal agenda/agument you are having.  Because I have said neither of these things.

What I have said is that this is our system of government (representative democracy), congress chooses how to allocated tax revenues, and WE control who makes up the congress.  This is the check and the balance.  Right now, congress is swinging to the left after 12 years of being controlled by the right.  I expect the new congress to improve things under Obama's leadership.  You fear they will not.  Time will tell.

And again, I've never equated money with social justice or compassion.  YOU keep using that as a metric and then trying to prove it is, to yourself.  My previous epic post to you should have cleared my position up once and for all on this matter.

Then just treat my positions as one man's educated opinion.  It's just a forum thread, amigo.  I've been handling flame wars like this since we did this on 300 baud modems on BBSs.  In my opinion, you are taking this MUCH too seriously.  I'm just a customer and you're just vendor.  And as such, in this country, we're both just men, and our words and votes carry equal weight under the law.

Apparently, ditto! 

On a new topic, same idea, what does everything think should be done about possibly bailing out the big three automakers here in the US.  I won't state my position at the outset this time.

=={Just who does he mean by that?}

Regarding how the policies (specifically the tax cut) of Bush's administration have affected US debt, which of course, directly impacts the value of the US dollar, the price of oil (since it is priced in US dollars), and the current state of our economy.

Notice in the following chart how over 1/2 of all of the public debt we've accumulated under Bush has been to cover the loss of income to the federal treasury due to Bush's tax cuts.  That's money we've BORROWED from the Chinese, Japanese, UK, etc. to cover our own bills.

Look I'm all for keeping taxation as lite as possible for everyone, but this tax cut took us BELOW what we needed just to run our country day to day.  I think we should try to match our expenses to our incoming revenues as closely as is reasonable, accounting for the ebb and flow of year to year unpredictabilities.  But this is unconscionable.

Further notice how 1/3rd of the national debt has gone to pay for increased "National Security" spending, which is, actually to primarily pay for the war in Iraq.   Again, all of this is borrowed money that we as Americans will have to pay off...with interest.  There is no free lunch here. 

It also weakens us on the world stage in that it's clear the US has NO leverage over the Chinese on human rights, importing tainted goods, Taiwan, etc.  We used to be the nation of "walk tall, but carry a big stick".  Now we are the country of "please don't call in our notes!" 

Now, even putting aside the fact that the GOP has veto power from the White House for 8 years, and majority control of congress for 12 years, you'll see that the part of this actually under congress's direct control is only 16% (entitlements and other domestic spending).   And even that was entirely on the GOP agenda as they controlled the heads of all committees and determined which legislation would face a vote and which would not - the right of the majority party.

Finally, this is all BEFORE the current economic collapse.  That's added another $1 - 2.5 trillion added to this debt, depending on when you start counting bank and Wall Street bailouts.  And it wasn't congress's idea to bailout the banks.  It was Paulson's and I remember Bush getting on the air to tell us how afraid we need to be that very next morning. 

Fortunately, the American people FREAKED with an unprecidented negative response barrage and that forced congress to add strings and conditions (like, "hey, we want to be paid back or we own you") to the second attempt at passing the bill.

So if the bailout debt is considered, Bush's policies of the tax cut + preemptive war in iraq + bailout means that his administration's responsbility for the fix our nation finds itself in is even greater that this chart indicates.

So where on this chart do we blame the tax and spend liberals rather than the supposedly small government, spend within your means conservatives?  Maybe, just maybe, the parties have switched here.

While I may be socially liberal (and believe in Universal Healthcare and equal rights for all) I am fiscally conservative.  By eliminating the Bush tax cut and ending the Iraq War, our nation will only be approaching ZERO.  We're not talking surplusses here.  We're all fighting about how do we just get this nation back on budget! 

Breakdown of debt incurred between 2001 and 2006.^[52]

image and citation courtesy of wikipedia from public government sources.

Ask the average American what's more important, the "War on Terror" or their Child's Education and College Eduction and how they're gonna afford it, or ask what's more important, affordable healthcare or Defense spending, and you'll find the country is far more "left"  then it is right leaning. Ask most educated people, what's a better approach, irresponsible tax cuts in the midst of War, or an increase in taxes when in time of War to avoid DEFICIT spending. The liberals are always labeled "Tax and Spend!!" but now I have to say, conservatives are "Deficit Spending through Tax Cuts and MASSIVE defense spending"...doesn't match with what the American people want. Problem? The American people are for the most part, unaware of just how much waste goes on in Washington across the board with both parties, and especially the Republicans over the last 8 years. It's a disgrace. At least Clinton, who was a moderate, balanced the budget and kept the dollar strong...the lousy fiat currency that it is.

Personally, I don't think the conservaitves, if they follow their core beliefs and stay away from the social issues, speak very logically on many issues. But, the Right's Top down approach to the Economy has been an epic failure and is coming apart at the seams. What we need in this country is a different mindset by the people calling the shots, a lefty approach, otherwise noted as a Bottom Up approach to the mess we're facing right now. We're already seeing what Top Down economics and supply side economics is giving us, AIG, Goldman Sacs, etc..fraud and downright theft of the American Taxpayer...all under Republican watch.

Major shifts people, major shifts are going to happen, so site back, light one up , and enjoy the fireworks. 

And that is an epic oversimplification which begins with a false premise accepted as its own conclusion, and which substitutes emotion for knowledge, facts & logic.

That would seem to be at odds with Article 1, Sections 7 & 9, not to mention rather misleading.

Which got passed by a congress controlled by Democrats, so what exactly is your point?

One could argue that without our army fighting wars like these they wouldn't have those feedoms. I'm not saying im for staying there like we have, but you have to look at the situation from both angles.