State of the WinCustomize Community

WinCustomize for the remaining year

Published on August 20, 2008 By Island Dog In OS Customization

I thought now would be as good as ever to write a "State of the Community" post. Over the past couple of weeks I have noticed a lot of negativity coming back to our forums, which have been a positive place for a while now. Negative and discouraging comments on skins have been increasing, and when a post was made to address it, it turns into another argument and battle. This really needs to stop and it will one way or another.

I do want to take a moment and give a big hats off to Zoomba. Just over two years ago he took over WinCustomize and associated Stardock sites, and since then we have seen many, many improvements. Not all are visible to everyone, but believe me a lot of work is done behind the scenes to make the experience at WinCustomize better. If you don't listen to the WinCustomize SkinCast (which I don't know why you wouldn't), you might have missed that Zoomba has moved on from WinCustomize. He's now doing some great work on Impulse, but thankfully he still has a part in WinCustomize, although not so much public now.

Community

The thing I have always had pride in at WinCustomize was the community. When I first started skinning people would jump at the opportunity to help, and not say that isn't happening now, but the tone has definitely changed over the years. Obviously, skinning has changed over the years as well. Commercial skinning now has a definite market and some don't seem to take too kindly to that. Regardless of how skinning has evolved it shouldn't have an impact on how the community treats each other or behaves.

The insulting comments and bullying of other members will not be tolerated at all, regardless of their rank or status on the site. We want WinCustomize to be a place where anyone can come and upload their skins and be part of this community, without having to be subject to ridiculous comments that only drive people away. For newer skinners out there, you will get criticism on your works, but don't take it personally. Listening to experienced skinners will only help you get better. On that note, giving constructive criticism is fine, but blatant attacks and insults do not help, and will be dealt with.

Here at WinCustomize we have a class system:

Citizen
Apprentice
Master Apprentice
Journeyman
Master
Wizop/Moderators

You can view specifics of each class here. Basically, you start out at citizen and if you contribute skins and to the community, you will be promoted through each of the classes. Promotion is done by recommendation and votes from the site moderators (wizops) and admins on a monthly basis. The Journeyman level allows users to bypass moderation, so your skins go directly to the gallery. The highest class most can achieve is Master, but this is not an easy road. One of the advantages of becoming a Master skinner is the ability to sell your skins on WinCustomize. There are just a handful of them currently, and we are always keeping our eye out for the next one.

This is a system that has been around for a long time, but lately I have been pondering if changes are needed, especially when it comes to the Master class. One of the descriptions of Master is, "not only must the user be a significant contributor to the community, but instrumental to the day to day life of WinCustomize." We have Master skinners that contribute quite a bit to the galleries, both free and paid skins, but are not necessarily active in say the forums for instance. Not everyone is into the forum scene, so how much leeway should be given for that? Should it matter? Those are all questions I have been asking myself lately, and one of my projects is to re-write the member descriptions and define member classes going forward.

Ideally, I would love to see all Master skinners take a more active and positive role in the community, be true leaders to help guide the next-generation of skinners. They are the "best of the best" in terms of what they do, but maybe just contributing skins isn't enough. Is more community involvement needed? I would definitely love your feedback on this. I will also be looking for skin moderators soon, so anybody in the community that has been established for a while can feel free to contact me.

Skinning

This summer has been fantastic. Usually during this time of year skin submissions drop to almost nothing, but not this summer. I haven't looked at the numbers but I think submissions have actually increased. I am also seeing a lot of new skinners make their way over here, which is even more exciting. Skinners who have been missing for a while have also made some returns, so I am very excited on the skinning front. Not to mention the GUI Champs 2008 is due to start very soon, I think the next half of this year is going to be great.

Halloween and the Christmas season are also approaching, and I would really like to get some good sets of skins going, possibly even another community based skin. I also have a mockup skin that will be the basis of a community project, but not until the GUI Champs is done. You all have enough on your hands as is.

Although I can't mention specifics, we have also been tossing around ideas for the next version of WinCustomize. Although nothing is set or guaranteed, I'm really hoping to have a bigger focus on personal pages and sorting of galleries. I will leave it at that for now.

Now lets address some issues people have been bringing up lately, and attempt to squash problems going forward. Gallery moderation has been going pretty smoothly. Most skins are moderated in good time, and we have been working to make sure a clear set of guidelines are followed. To make things easier for everyone, I wrote the Tips for Moderation guide which everyone who submits skins should look over.

Let me now emphasize some things to end some discussions and problems:

Resetting skin dates on updates will only be moderated if the skin has a significant change. Fixing a start menu issue, or altering the color slightly does not constitute that. Trying to game the system to stay on the front page of downloads will no longer pass.
Vista clones are permitted within reason. Some of the most popular skins across the net are modifications of Vista. The advantage we have with WindowBlinds is that the skins can be much, much better than the default Aero look. Now we all have personal opinions on Vista looking skins, and the origins of images, but it's things we have gone through and determined it's not a simple matter to determine who created what.
Multiple colors of the same skin must be included in a pack, or sub-styles. SkinStudio has a remarkable re-coloring feature which makes making separate colored sub-styles very easy so this is what I would recommend.

Conclusion

Overall, I have been very happy with the state of WinCustomize this year. Although there are some minor bumps in the road lately, those are ending today and I expect a great time for the rest of this year. Your comments and feedback are welcomed.

Comments (Page 2)

Vampothika

on Aug 20, 2008

Nice article. I am looking forward to the negative issues being resolved soon.

mommaTee

on Aug 20, 2008

Nice article. I am looking forward to the negative issues being resolved soon.

Ditto.

eieio

on Aug 20, 2008

pictoratus....there are high level members here who are hardly ever on Wincustomize.com but their position/status reflects their involvement in the 'community' elsewhere..on other sites such as Deviantart ....

As well it should be .. again in my opinion. Although I would include participation in many of the smaller 'niche' sites as well as DeviantArt.

It would be a shame, although understandable to a degree, for a skinner to be passed over or not even considered for promotion due to little or no presence in the WC forums and/or galleries.

One of those out of sight; out of mind situations.

Skinhit

on Aug 20, 2008

Thanks ID...I forgot to do one this year.
Interesting reads->from 2006WWW Link
And then 2007->WWW Link
Funny how we always take one step forward and then two steps back...

Jafo

on Aug 20, 2008

As well it should be .. again in my opinion. Although I would include participation in many of the smaller 'niche' sites as well as DeviantArt.

Yes, all are included....I just used Devart as an example....

pjdark

on Aug 20, 2008

Sometimes even the greatest of communities well,............. just need more cowbell.

Bebi Bulma

on Aug 20, 2008

It would be a shame, although understandable to a degree, for a skinner to be passed over or not even considered for promotion due to little or no presence in the WC forums and/or galleries.

Why should someone get promoted here when they aren't even active here? If there's someone active on dA who uploads a bunch of stuff there, but nothing here, how are they doing WC any good? How are they benefiting this community?

DEVJIT

on Aug 20, 2008

I was just doing my final report and thought of following up on the threads.(Slightly concerned about I guess the recent threads)..ID +1 for this and thanks this thread means a lot to a lot of members and to all the masters whose skills and guidance are invaluable to the WC community

So please keep on guiding whenever possible,where ever possible

Skinhit

on Aug 20, 2008

Why should someone get promoted here when they aren't even active here? If there's someone active on dA who uploads a bunch of stuff there, but nothing here, how are they doing WC any good?

Bebi you should be asking that question of Jafo, not Pictoratus...

ShelbyGT_The_Car

on Aug 20, 2008

Island Dog is right to mark with what is what for the moderation process to be done in this fashion. My only opinion on this is "WOW" it is going to make the mods job so hard to get everything done as quick as it has been before. Moderation now will have to begin with research and then investigation of a lot of aspects. This is needed as for the things present and I fully agree with what it concerns.
I do not want to bring up the bumps in the road from the recent past. They should be left there and the community is ready to move on with what lies a head. Which Island Dog has stated is to be good. That is what it will be...
I'm a bit concerned about the change in the Masters who do not participate much in the forums. A lot of them work directly with Stardock now on and off. I feel these people have less time to actually get into what is going on with the forums completely. Thus they are exempt from this ruling I would hope.
Also that of those Masters who do put there participation into the forums with help for new skinners and/or such whoever for thus whatever the cause. Should receive some sort of recognition for their efforts and achievements like wise.
I just feel that this can be hard for some who are really busy with artwork. Thus having such little time to visit with other members. That or they have been less involved due to the way the forums are going. To say that they do not care to get involved unless it concerns something they are part of and so forth. That is a big loop to looking into and such. I would not want to ask or hear what that answer was from some as such for this question. The definition could be as hard to define also.

My hopes are that the community will realize the mods/admins are doing their best to keep things good and pleasing here at the site for everyone. That and we need to work closer with our mods/admins and respect the rules set out for the site. To keep the site in a good working community for less problems and better achievement of what is the proper way to handle problems. With of course that of things that will be made for bettering the site in a whole manner.
I believe we have our own ideas - each of us does - for how and what we want this community to be. Island Dog is asking this here and we need to give a proper answer and not the answer of no I do not care - do what you want with such and such.
Here is another thing too. If you have a problem and do not trust the PM thing here then you have to try another way. Such as a direct contact with said admin/mod... there are other ways to contact people here. Email is one and another is via personal web contact.
If you really need to talk with these people over something needed you can try this.
I will be here to help anyone who needs whatever and wants to contact a mod or admin. I'll do my best to get you hooked up privately.

All in all the community is as Island Dog has said. We are all getting a better way of seeing things and trying to work together. We can do it and it will make everyone better.

Thanks Island Dog for this thread - it is well needed and I hope for all the best here in the future.

TYCUS

on Aug 20, 2008

GRREAT! when can we start with the brain storms?

kenwas

on Aug 21, 2008

Since Day One in skinning it has always been acceptable practise to port an OS graphics to another program. The earliest I can remember was Amiga to Litestep....that was around '97 or '98. Currently you have Vista's default graphics ported to Windowblinds so they end up on XP, say. There is one proviso, however...on any of these 'ports'. If and when the OS 'owner' decides it is not acceptable the offending work is removed.

I struggle with the logic here. Would it also be deemed acceptable if someone used some of the graphic elements of lets say a gef skin to create art work for a WB and gef himself did not complain and demand removal? Is there any difference? It seems that the policy is a matter of convenience based on the popularity of clones, ports, what have you, which by the way, I agree that WC has every right to make from a business point of view. Perhaps, I am missing something or being overly simplistic. As I said, I struggle with the logic. A timely and excellent post on the state of things ID. Thank you. There have always been little bumps in the road but in the case of WC, the good always out weighs the bad.

WebGizmos

on Aug 21, 2008

ID....As far as your pondering the "Master" class spending more time in the forums...I'm sure it would be great and beneficial to some people and I'm sure a lot of the Masters have thought about it...but the problem is...time...it takes a lot time to produce those Master skins...they don't just pop out of thin air...so if they spend more time in the forums...the less time they have doing what they do best. So I think a lot of leeway should be given to them. Just my 2 cents.

I myself am always willing to answer questions of help anyone interested in creating docks. Hell....I'll even tutor over the phone if needed.

HG_Eliminator

on Aug 21, 2008

''

Difference is partly, one is a private entity and the other is corporate. Porting Os's has always been common place, as typically it is looked upon as fostering interest/advertising. On a rare occasion the Owner of the OS has requested specific skins to be removed for various reasons. It was figured a long time ago that if the owner of the os left a skin alone then it was silently accepted. If they wanted they have the resources to hunt each one down and ask it's removal, where as a single skinner does not. A single skinner is much more likely to make sure his rights are not infringed. So they typically do not allow "silent" porting.

As for the community. Together we stand divided we fall. Id really hate to see WC go the way of custo.org.

Play nice folks..

kenwas

on Aug 21, 2008

Difference is partly, one is a private entity and the other is corporate.

I do not sell skins but if I did, I would certainly take in the revenue via an LLC at the least for a whole variety of reasons. Unless, by corporate you mean publicly traded and I see no difference there. A company might decide that the stopping of a skin causes more bad PR than it is worth, but that is another matter entirely as it is merely a temporary decision until they decide otherwise. They always maintain the right. Having said that, I would agree that it would get harder and harder to enforce based on "past practices".

On a rare occasion the Owner of the OS has requested specific skins to be removed for various reasons. It was figured a long time ago that if the owner of the os left a skin alone then it was silently accepted. If they wanted they have the resources to hunt each one down and ask it's removal, where as a single skinner does not. A single skinner is much more likely to make sure his rights are not infringed.

This seems contradictory to me. If the single skinner does not have the resources, than how would he/she be more likely to make sure his rights are not infringed?

As for the community. Together we stand divided we fall. Id really hate to see WC go the way of custo.org.

Agreed 100%

Play nice folks..

I always do.

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